I set my recordings to start 3 minutes before and stop 3 minutes after when possible.  The bug that I have noticed is that when there are two shows on the same channel back to back that are scheduled to record, Windows Media Center stops the first show 3 minutes after.  This means the second show is cut off by a few minutes.

Maybe the logic was that both programs are still recorded so it doesnt matter.  The flaw is that you have to watch the last few minutes of the first show to catch the beginning of the program of the second show. 

My preference would be that media center should see this and select a different tuner to record the second show and preserve the 3 minutes after on the first show and 3 minutes before on the second.  If only one tuner is available, that end the first show on time and start the second show on time. 

Does anyone else notice this?  ...or maybe I am doing something wrong.

This is one of the biggest issues people have with Media Centre.  It's been like that for quite a while even though many have complained, and the solution seems obvious.

FWIW, I guess there's a patent or contractual issue that's tying Microsoft's hands.  I can't believe it's something technical.

Andy

Check out this thread in the comments on tuner swaps.  http://thegreenbutton.com/blogs/windows_media_center_team_blog/archive/2009/10/10/393739.aspx#394982

 Ideally MC would swap tuners like the Tivo and finish one recording and start the next using the other tuner and create an overlap. I think when I've done this (with settings of starting one minute early and ending one minute late when possible) that the start and stop happen on the scheduled show end time on the outgoing program and start on the scheduled start time for the incoming show. But networks often don't adhere to clock time and since the demise of station breaks, there often isn't fudge factor anymore.

John

BINGO! If someone asked me my most hated bug in MC7, it would be the tuner selection algorithm (or lack thereof!)

But it's from the same channel! Why it can't just write the same data to two recording files during that overlapping period...

This annoys the crap out of me, and I'm sure that Vista Media Center never had this problem.

If it wasn't for the 1.25x play speed, I'd be going back to Vista.

I'm in Australia and have four dvb-t tuners.  Even when recording only two programs on the same channel back to back Windows 7 will truncate either the first recording if it is set to record 'when possible' (soft padding) or start the second recording late if the first has hard padding.

This definitely was not the same behaviour as Vista where I was using the same four tuners and it would record two back to back programs on two separate tuners with the padding maintained.

Interestingly I had not seen this same problem documented myself except by another person on the local media center forum where other members replied that this was an isolated problem not affecting them - http://www.xpmediacentre.com.au/community/windows-7-media-center-software/37379-recording-back-back-programs-2-tuners-media-center.html.

I have recently set up a test sandbox to diagnose this problem because I did not think it had been happening for the whole time I have been running Windows 7 and while I have not finished testing, I can confirm that in a virgin Windows 7 install back to back programs record correctly (i.e. including padding so the programs overlap).  Based on my preliminary analysis it appears that once all tuners have been in use one time it will no longer record the padding at any stage - although my testing has not been exhaustive so this could be a coincidence.

I'm guessing this is a software problem and not related to some configuration of hardware or tuner types as this is affecting people in different regions (although the fact that others have stated this doesn't affect them worries me a bit), so is there somewhere this can be reported so people at Microsoft can look at it?  I'd be very surprised if this behaviour was by design given what I've found. 

AussieMcGoo

so is there somewhere this can be reported so people at Microsoft can look at it?  I'd be very surprised if this behaviour was by design given what I've found. 

I think they're already aware of it.

This is a comment in that link given a few posts up:
"There are a number of TGB threads which talk about "Pre/Post Padding" issues. I am afraid that the PVR just doesnt do the tuner swapping you talk about. Hopefuly we can add it as a feature in Win Next."

There really is no excuse for not having this fixed in W7 - it has been documented for years, people have hated it for years yet nothing was done about it.  I would love to know why.

Rich

dmagerl

I think they're already aware of it.

This is a comment in that link given a few posts up:
"There are a number of TGB threads which talk about "Pre/Post Padding" issues. I am afraid that the PVR just doesnt do the tuner swapping you talk about. Hopefuly we can add it as a feature in Win Next."

Can anyone post links to these other forum threads as I've been looking for a while and not come across the same thing.  I think people may be getting confused about the issue I'm posting about (or I'm confused about what the original posts were reporting). 

For me this is not pre and post padding when all tuners are in use, the difference between soft and hard padding, or getting Microsoft to use one tuner to record two programs on the same channel back to back by writing to two different files.

This relates to MCE not using tuners when they're available to record overlapping programs on the same channel which I can confirm Vista did record correctly at least for dvb-t tuners and a clean install of Windows 7 does before something changes which causes it to not overlap the programs afterwards.

As a developer I'm pretty confident I can recognise a bug when I see it - after all I've created many, many myself ;-)  If it's already been noted to Microsoft great because I'm lazy at heart, but if not I would like to report it as it's a real pain.

Its all the same issue. The fact that it only uses 1 tuner cuts off the post padding of the first show and cuts off the pre padding of the following show.  If two tuners were used, each show would have their paddings intact. But the padding is the least part of the bug.  It changes the channel from the program you're watching, it puts up these obnoxious pop up messages about changing channels, and it never uses any idle tuners except for simultaneous recordings.

Do a search for "tuner assignment algorithm" or "back to back recording". There have been many threads dating back all the way to XP.

dmagerl

Its all the same issue. The fact that it only uses 1 tuner cuts off the post padding of the first show and cuts off the pre padding of the following show.  If two tuners were used, each show would have their paddings intact. But the padding is the least part of the bug.  It changes the channel from the program you're watching, it puts up these obnoxious pop up messages about changing channels, and it never uses any idle tuners except for simultaneous recordings.

Do a search for "tuner assignment algorithm" or "back to back recording". There have been many threads dating back all the way to XP.

Ok now that I've searched on all categories not just windows 7 I've found what you're talking about, so thanks (probably should have done that first, might have stopped me from being such a pain).  Still doesn't explain why it worked for a year and half on Vista for me without a hitch - maybe something to do with the registry hacks to get four tuners working.  Also doesn't explain why it works on a clean Windows 7 install (try it if you have four tuners, install Windows 7 on a new partition and the first thing you do in Media Center is after setup is record back to back programs it records both with padding intact).  I can't believe this is something to do with the tuning algorithm, has to be a bug surely?  What's taking them so long to fix it?  I guess it's one of those great mysteries of the universe :-p

I actually don't have this problem.  I was concerned when I had back-to-back shows being recorded. 

What I found is that when this happens, I get two separate recordings, with both having the leading and trailing minutes. 

Example:  Recorded Ghost Hunters from 8:58 to 10:02, and Destination Truth from 9:58 to 11:02 on the same channel and the same turner.

Both shows are complete (with leading and trailing minutes).

I am running VMC without the 2008 TV Pack.

I think it was stated that this might work in Vista.

mmatheny

I think it was stated that this might work in Vista.

Actually I think this is the contentious issue.  Some people are stating they've had the same behaviour since XP while others such as myself have been stating this is new to Windows 7.  Having had time to read through the issues described as "tuning algorithm" I'm not convinced it's the same issue. I only found one other person who reported something similar to this thread, whilst some others thought they were getting something similar but did not have padding set up for their recording and when they set up it started padding both recordings.  The behaviour described by dejavux2 is what I was experiencing in Vista although it would use two tuners to tape the recordings not one and is correct based on the padding set up as Vista uses hard padding for end times rather that giving you the option to use soft padding that Windows 7 does. It still seems to me to be a bug introduced in Windows 7 and as such should be brought to the team's attention.

Well I can categorically state that this has never worked in Vista (for me at least), with a variety of DVB-T dual tuner cards. I originally raised it on TGB as a Vista issue. I can't speak for MCE2005, as I only had a single tuner back in those days.

If I schedule two consecutive programs on different channels to record, everything works perfectly. The first recording will end a few minutes after the end of the first program, and the second recording will start a few minutes before the second program starts. So there are are a few minutes of overlap while both channels are recording simultaneously.

However, if the consecutive programs are on the same channel, there is no tuner swap, and this does not happen. I will typically end up with the start of the second program tacked on to the end of the first recording, which invariably I delete, and then when I sit down to watch the second recording I find the first couple of minutes are missing.

So Media Center needs to either:

1. Swap tuners when consecutive programs are on different channels so it can stream the overlap to two separate files

2. Simply stream the overlap to two separate files from a single tuner. Surely not rocket science...

Very disappointed to hear that this bug (yes, I'll call it a bug) still exists in W7. 

 JB