Just purchased my first Media Center PC (VMC).  I am a new member of this forum and this is my second post. 

First of all, thanks everyone for all the good information over here.  It helped convince me that VMC was the best solution available today and is the reason I made a purchase.

My only comment is this is the only forum where it seems the users are hostile to the manufacture and the manufacture is almost hostile to the community (mainly in response to the comments).

I guess I am used to the days when the user base supported the vendor that made the products that we all get so much use from.   

...just something that seems unique to this board.

Things are just extra tense right now...

There has never been a product that is so tightly integrated with people's everyday lives and then just suddenly, we have never had a direct conduit with the creators.

Hang in there...Media Center is worth it and I think MS is thinking the same thing (hopefully)...

You just joined only minutes ago :) You have jumped in at a very odd time. You see, many of us here at tgb have been waiting for years for the features included in TV Pack 2008. unfortunately Microsoft has released it only to the OEM. So if your sensing a little frustration, that would be why. Most of us here love media center, many of us have spent fortunes on equipment, and countless hours making it the perfect fit in our homes, Hence the reason so many feelings are hurt when Microsoft decides to leave us in the dark. Hope this lull doesn't last long. enjoy your reading here at tgb. :) -Doug

Tense couple of days for most, and some (myself included) have,with some lack of thinking, said some silly things.
But hey any other day of the week 99% of the users including Microsoft and other vendors are always very helpful and considerate.
Truely hope you stick with us and see this community for what it truely is.

Cheers

I guess I am just used to being in forums where the users really stick up for the vendors.  I guess I understand.  I purchased my Vista Premium OEM from Dell on 17-July 2008 with Dual CableCARD tuners.  If I had known, I may have waited.  Dell said nothing about this Media Pack.  I wonder if I qualify for an upgrade.  (probably not).

Well put.  I agree completely, despite all of the moaning on this board VMC is still the best HTPC OS out there.  I think that we power users sometimes lose sight of everything that VMC can do and always focus on what it can't do (I include my self in this group).  Yes VMC does seem to evolve a little slower than other apps out there, but I wouldn't trade it for any of them.   hang in there indeed.  You can definitely look forward to wowing your friends and family the first time you demo your system to them.  You will inevitably get the question "That's cool, can you build one for me?"  Enjoy.

Also, I know that a lot of people are screaming for DVD streaming to extenders, and that seems to be where the latest vitriol spewing posts are targeted.  I certainly would like to see dvd streaming to extenders but if it doesn't happen, it is not the end of the world.  With the imminent release of OML (Open Media Library) I will probably convert my DVD's to Xvid or MWV and use OML to watch from an extender.  I know, this isn't a perfect solution for everyone but it will work well enough for me.

 

 

Thanks for the feedback, epete.  I too have noticed some amount of negativity in many of the threads, and I agree with a couple of the comments made about users feeling frustration with the Windows Media Center release process and business model.  I really only have two comments to add.  First, remember that EVERYONE here loves Media Center and we all believe in the potential that exists to make it even better.  Second, when the posts start to get negative and spiral out of control with speculation... remember that those of us in eHome that build the product and make the business decisions are NOT out to get consumers (like some would try to make you believe).  We want to help (which is why we are here) and we want to build something that everyone is proud of.  After all, we use it in our homes, as well.

Welcome to the TGB community, and I look forward to many positive discussions in the future. 

Jeff;

Well put.  Although it is easy to complain, my family and I love Vista Media Centre and use it because it does more "all-in-one" than any other product I have ever tried.  Friends and family who see my system are amazed at what it can do.  Now that V2 extenders ( I use DMA 2100's) are out, I like it even more and I'm amazed that I can extend the experience at a low cost to other TV's in my house (I decommissioned other Vista Ultimate PC's due to the complexity of sharing Recorded TV and power consumption).  In addition to the solid MS base, it is great that many third party add-ins have made it even better.

Sure, more support for better TV viewing, (e.g. clear QAM), DVD streaming, and Blu-ray would make it even better. I trust these features will be added in the future to make VMC competitive with other vendor offerings.       

I hate to continue the "negative atmosphere" (not really), but EVERYONE here does NOT love Vista Media Center.  I liked Media Center 2005.  After a few initial glitches, it became stable and I invested beacoups into a OEM Media Center PC and V1 extenders.  I still run it today, because VMC offers absolutely no reason to invest new money in a new system (plus I LOATHE Vista).

What I "loved" was the promise of what Media Center could be.  When it came out in 2004 (notice when I joined this forum), it was the answer to something I had been looking for since I bought my first house in 1992.  I have always had computers and my Home Entertainment System "integrated" to some degree, but it has always been cobbled togethered from disparate pieces and parts, and never satisfying.  In 2004, when MCE was released, it was the promise of digital convergence made by Bill Gates all the way back in 1984 finally realized.  Just a few patches, a couple of service packs, and some obvious feature upgrades, and it would be perfect.

Now, over 4 years later Vista MC gets TV Pack 2008, and it still won't have the features of MCE 2005.  I have said it dozens of times, now, but I will say it again.  The problem is that Microsoft decided to treat Media Center as just another add-on to the OS, like MovieMaker or Calculator.  That has been the role to which it has been relegated, and that is when it really lost its luster.  Jeff and Charlie and the others can talk about "usage scenarios" and listening to customers, but no one has ever listened to anything that I and others have said on this site about SoftSled, DVD streaming, mutliple Media Centers talking to each other, HD from DirecTV, etc.  If they had been listening, we would have had these features YEARS ago.  There are no technical hurdles here, simply Microsoft's lack of interest in delivering these features that keeps the product from fulfilling its promise.

That is where the frustration comes from, thinking about what might have been, if only...

On the feature points, Windows 7's current list of improvements will fix basically all your after, which is similar to what Im after (except for some additions to help the Aussie TV land).

One disheartening thing is that Media Portal, another Windows based media centre, has basically all the features Im after, its just a bit unstable with my not perfect TV signal (DVB-T) and a bit more of a pain to configure and doesnt quite look as good.  But feature wise it walks all over MCE

But it pulls EIT EPG data, connects to IMDB to get movie info, has a VERY simple first screen you can enable (5 options, TV, movies, music, pictures aand... something), can work analogue tuners at the same time as digital, can run in 1000 configurations with TV servers and front ends everywhere, etc.

 

Media portal is IMO what VMC should be aiming for feature wise.

Media Center can be better. When I first did demos of MCE2005 in our store people were amazed!. I sold dozens of systems still in use today. Now when I show VMC, people say "oh yea, I have that on my laptop." I'm running out of features... I can't hardly sell a system anymore because all the oem's have it :( People really want blu-ray, premium cable, direcTV HD, and networked recorded tv. It's different than 2 years ago, it changes quickly. I wish I could go back to the good old days when people were amazed by music, pictures, home movies, and Standard Def. recorded TV. It has gotten to the point where I just don't even want to show it anymore :( I have spent so much time dealing with my HD home run hacks, aver m780 qam guide problems, power dvd, and media extreme problems, recorded tv network sharing issues. I just want the WOW! factor back. :(

I also know the hurt of hard work unappreciated. People don't know what it takes to run all the wiring, hang all the TV's, network all the PC's, share the recorded tv, rip the dvd's, program the remotes, TEACH THEM HOW TO USE IT. While ocasionally someone will send a thank you note, or give me a pat on the back, It's rare, people are so quick to critsize the fact that it doesn't do everything they want it to. So I do want to thank the people from the ehome team, and all the Microsoft people who post here. I love the system you have worked sooo hard to build. I know the red tape that can't be explained to the masses, and I look forward to anything you can offer in the future.  

kingwr:

Jeff and Charlie and the others can talk about "usage scenarios" and listening to customers, but no one has ever listened to anything that I and others have said on this site...  If they had been listening, we would have had these features YEARS ago.  There are no technical hurdles here, simply Microsoft's lack of interest in delivering these features that keeps the product from fulfilling its promise.

You are entitled to your opinion.  However, your comments clearly demonstrate a lack of understanding of how we plan, build, and release software... especially when it needs to be coordinated with numerous hardware, sofware, and service partners.  I don't fault you for this, because it is largely our own fault for not being more transparent.  Obviously, we can not be completely transparent about ALL of our business decisions and partnerships, but I personally believe that we should be able to provide a clearer picture of our development roadmap.  That is what I hope to change over time with our involvement in TGB.  You won't always like the answers when we decide to deprioritize or cut requested features, but at the very least you'll be able to make an informed decision to either use Media Center or not use it.

I'm not sure where you are coming from with the comment that we "still don't have the features of MCE 2005", because we have made several major advancements in many feature areas and very few regressions that I am aware of.  We might not have done everything that you personaly want to see, but you need to remember that features are prioritized based on numerous factors for our users and partners in the global marketplace.

All that said, if you continue to participate in the community regardless of your frustration, I hope you choose to do so in a positive and constructive manner.

JeffTucker – MSFT:

... but I personally believe that we should be able to provide a clearer picture of our development roadmap.  That is what I hope to change over time with our involvement in TGB. 

Jeff,

If you can achieve this you will make lots of people very happy and solve a lot of negitivity issues. I encourage you to persue this goal. Good luck.

Ben

Jeff,

More transparency will indeed greatly help the poor view of VMC currently in the community. What you are seeing on these forums, to a large extent, is a significant degree of frustration over lack of basic features requested by the community for many years..and more importantly, a lack of any real information as to current and future support for these features. Many of us have been waiting for a feature list that will be found in Fuji, before deciding if we want to abandon VMC entirely.

One key issue has been an emphasis on high-end, premium OEMs, at the expense of system builders.

It is incredibly frustrating to know that I can design and build a superior VMC system for less than half the price charged by a premium OEM like Niveus, Vidabox, and the like. In addition, with the current DRM insanity, few are willing to make the investment in Cablecard OEM systems that may be obsolete within months, without ANY assurance of an upgrade path. I can tolerate swapping a $200 OCUR module..I cannot tolerate swapping yet ANOTHER $2000 OEM system for a new standard.

The Directv solution, that has been promised for years will solve much of this..if its allowed as an add-on to a standalone system, rather than yet another new, OEM only solution.

Essentially, before I spend one more dollar of money on Vista Media Center, I want to know that what ever investment I make for myself, and my clients will not be immediately obsolete, with new "oem only" upgrades and DRM solutions.

Finally..the DRM issue really needs to be resolved. If managed copy is not released soon, everyone will be using "unmanaged copy" using AnydvdHD. Most people start down the slippery piracy slope due to an inability to use media in a fair manner.